@Draven Grey Thank you. Now I realize I've already been doing the hyoid pull but the way I learned to hold back air for false fold compression based grit, the hyoid pull is something I included with that air restriction. Since I always do compression and hyoid pull together, I didn't discern between holding back air and doing the hyoid pull; doing both together was like one technique to me. What uou just wrote makes sense to me, because it is possible to hold back air and not get any grit. The constriction is the difference maker between getting grit and just sounding like you're holding back air while phonating.

@Draven Grey That sounds great! And I'm glad I'm on the right track with what I'm hearing in Halford's voice.

@Draven Grey Is this a course that would be available to buy where people can learn to identify what all these different techniques sound like in a variety of vocalists and receive some description or instruction on how to do what they're doing? It seems to me that every type of grit uses constriction, so it would stand to reason that whether they know it or not, all these different singers must be using a hyoid pull because without it, there is no constriction.

@Draven Grey I'm afraid the sound didn't come through on the video the one that lasts 9:13 that imagine was about how MAPHRA gets her sound, Hopefully the sound was recorded and just needs to be added in! The Entropy video was intense, especially the screaming right near the end.. Disturbing images! As for MAPHRA, like I said, hopefully the audio did get recorded and there;s some way to add it to the video, but if not can I at least ask you: I'm a bit confused because you said MAPHRA uses "a break-apart/sing-scream, from a very crown-focused, British slang "Oi!" position" in the first reply to the original post, but in the second reply you call it."Hardcore bark" that she gets. My guess is she uses both and. the video would show where she's using break apart/sing scream and where she's using Hardcore Bark. Do you think MAPHRA is exploiting her vocal break (a technique we discussed recently in another post that you said you use sometimes as well as another teacher you trained)? I watched a bunch if reactions to Doomed and one coach, C.L. said MAPHRA's distortion technique is exactly what he teaches and it's all based around exploiting the vocal break which I guess would be in line with calling it break-apart/sing scream which I think I hear from 1:10 into the video until 1:32 for example. I tried to hear the Hardcore bark when I went back to the video of her cover just now and all I hear is the fall apart with the vocal break. It sounds that way to me because it's a looser sounding distortion than a higher compression technique like Hardcore Break that creates a tighter more consistent sounding distortion than the fall apart with the vocal break. Sorry that got so long. To summarize: 1. Is MAPHRA exploiting her vocal break in Doomed where she creates a break-apart/sing scream as C.L. says in his analaysis? For example, where she first uses distortion in the song 1:10 - 1:32 it all sounds like fall-apart distortion to me. Am I right about that?

@Draven Grey I really appreciated hearing how different it sounded when you sang it close to your bridge, as opposed to close to her bridge, where she sings it. It certainly influences the sound because as you said, you can't compress on a B4 the way that she can. No man can. The only things I'm a little concerend about are: When you sang it in sing scream (fall apart), it's hard for me to distinguish between that sound and a fry scream. To me sing scream and fry scream sound very similar, but maybe I'll eventually learn to discern between the two sounds. You say she uses sing scream and hardcore bark and I've been trying to find instances of her doing each, but to me her distrtion sounds pretty consistently like sing scream on this particular song. I'm wondering if maybe you meant she'd doing a distortion that is somewhere in between a sing scream and a hardcore bark. Is that even possible to do sort of a hybrid of sing scream and harcore bark? I've never heard anyone with grit quite like hers and I'm wondering if maybe part of that is that she's blending hardcore bark with sing scream at once - a hybrid technique. Then there are her opera type acoustics you described so maybe those account ofr why her distortion sounds different to me than anyone else I've heard, in that her distortion is so thick it almost sounds like a scream except that in a scream usually the singal from the true folds (the actual voice) is more hidden or obscured and her voice is right there, very prominent in the mix unlike the voices of screamers where you hear more distortion than actual voice. When she sings "And now there's no way back" i hear hear voice crack or flip up into head voice right at the end of the lyric "back." I thought that might be a sign she was exploiting ehr vocal break for grit, but I guess not since you got her sound in your sing scream without using your vocal break. The only vocal coach I hear do a somewhat similar take of parts of this song is C.L. when he did his analysis, but he didn't come as close to her sound as you did and he didn't even get into her opera type acoustics.

@Draven Grey Is it true that fry screams get their type of distortion from the true folds rather than the from the false folds? I have heard some coaches say that the vocal cord closure in a fry scream is different from singing melodically with grit and different from a false fold scream too - that instead of closing with that would typically be considered good cord closure (complete meeting if the cords along their edges during vibration), in a fry scream the cords adduct in a looser, more relaxed way where they sort of "sputter", resulting in the characteristic sound of fry scream type distortion.

That was very informative. Very well explained! Thank you.

@Draven Grey Thanks for the heads up on that. I heard your two 60 minute podcasts on distortion a couple months ago (good stuff!) and I need to listen to them again. I remember you saying Cornell bled the glottis of air in a decompressed distortion technique. Is bleeding the glottis done by intentionally letting air escape by singing in a breathy way?

@Deanna Bruce Welcome! Could a you name a few singers whose grit is kind of similar to the type of grit you'd like to use on your album?